February 2014 Update
February 02, 2014, 06:10:32 PM Posted by Arantor on February 02, 2014, 06:10:32 PM in February 2014 Update | 54 CommentsAnother month, another update 
A certain amount of January's time was taken up with 2.0.7 related stuff from the devs, but a healthy amount of things happened for 2.1 in the last few weeks.
* Bug fixes - I know I keep mentioning this, but it's important
2.1 represents a major release for us, but not enough to warrant a bump to 3.0; there's no significant architectural changes, but there are some serious focus changes, some changes to convention but more importantly: we've really been trying to focus on bug fixes, cleaning house in terms of bug reporting going back, trying to make 2.1 the very best release it can be, dealing with as many legacy bugs as possible. In particular, paid subscriptions has had a number of fixes applied to it.
* The conversion to HTML5 goes slowly, but it is progressing.
* One of the confusing aspects about permissions was manage boards - the problem of people being able to manage boards and change permissions but without that group potentially being able to see all boards. To that end, because of all the strange issues that can manifest, if a group has manage boards permission, that is effectively now a carte-blanche access to groups (since they could have given themselves that permission anyway).
* The debugging functionality has been improved: it now lists memory usage as well as the other stuff, makes some of the logging stuff work when it never used to properly.
* Calendar got some changes - creating new events will send alerts, the 'week x' thing has been removed (due to it causing a great many problems that can't properly be fixed)
* 2.1 features an extended version of what 2.0 had for installings mods. Whereas in 2.0 you could enter a version of SMF for mods to 'emulate', 2.1 now has an auto-complete list of versions which is updated from our servers like the notifications about doing updates in general.
* In 1.1 and 2.0, when uploading an avatar, they would be stored in the attachments folder. As of 2.1, they are stored in their own folder which allows for them to be called directly, which has a major performance increase (so much so that doing it manually was the number 1 performance recommendation for years, now we've just made it automatic)
* Outgoing email has been tweaked so that it should be slightly more reliable by always issuing a message id (as opposed to the relay doing it) and this should also allow for better diagnosis of issues.
* Several 'configurable' options have been removed; if they are on by default and unlikely to ever be disabled, there's really no point them being optional. Specifically: 'simple search', the 'mark as read' button, the 'go up/down' buttons' and 'display items on the link tree as links', though there are also some options that the code was aware of but never used which have also been cleaned up.
* More of the images are now made part of the sprite we use, enables improvements in performance and RTL support.
* If you use paid subscriptions now, when you leave the forum to go to PayPal, it will hopefully use the right language for you. Also, AUD and CAD are now currencies listed as standard.
* When examining the files in a theme, the theme's name is displayed. Not a major change, but a useful one.
* When using the reports function to get a report of all the boards in your forum, the report will also inform you about redirect boards.
* Because of all the issues around non-UTF-8 and conversions, all new installs will be UTF-8 only. Upgrades will not force conversion to UTF-8, so your existing database will work as expected during an upgrade, but new installs will be UTF-8 only to keep everything that much simpler in the long term.
* Send this topic (as in by email) has been removed; people use copy/paste these days or various social services. We have not yet decided whether we are going to add social sharing functions in the default (and it's not like there aren't a number of choices out there already)
* The function to email users from the forum is being phased out. That's what PMs are for
* When uploading an avatar (or downloading an external one, if configured), the maximum size is shown.
* Web Slice support, what there was of it, has been removed.
* Polls added to topics, edited, locked, unlocked, reset or removed are all now logged in the moderation log.
* Users that are hidden do not reveal their last online time (unless the viewing user could see them anyway, e.g. by being an administrator)
* The footer has been rejigged a little; there's no longer a link to the credits page (that's now in the help area), the footer now also has the link to the help page (no longer in the main menu!) and the terms & rules / reg agreement are also linked from the footer.
* When moving items into and out of the recycle board, the 'recycle icon' is no longer changed permanently.
* When merging two topics, the secondary topic(s) will no longer be deleted, but will now be a redirection to the newly merged topic.
As you can see, there's a lot of little changes in addition to the big stuff - that's something that we're looking at: even the little details are important. With that in mind, there is going to be a complete top-to-bottom look at everything in SMF to polish it all up
As ever, you can see how it's going on our Github - http://github.com/SimpleMachines/SMF2.1 - but we're still officially in alpha, and things are likely to change on a daily basis; you should not be running it on a production site unless you are prepared to keep things up to date and understand the consequences of it; we cannot provide our usual level of support for people running alpha code.
A certain amount of January's time was taken up with 2.0.7 related stuff from the devs, but a healthy amount of things happened for 2.1 in the last few weeks.* Bug fixes - I know I keep mentioning this, but it's important
2.1 represents a major release for us, but not enough to warrant a bump to 3.0; there's no significant architectural changes, but there are some serious focus changes, some changes to convention but more importantly: we've really been trying to focus on bug fixes, cleaning house in terms of bug reporting going back, trying to make 2.1 the very best release it can be, dealing with as many legacy bugs as possible. In particular, paid subscriptions has had a number of fixes applied to it.* The conversion to HTML5 goes slowly, but it is progressing.
* One of the confusing aspects about permissions was manage boards - the problem of people being able to manage boards and change permissions but without that group potentially being able to see all boards. To that end, because of all the strange issues that can manifest, if a group has manage boards permission, that is effectively now a carte-blanche access to groups (since they could have given themselves that permission anyway).
* The debugging functionality has been improved: it now lists memory usage as well as the other stuff, makes some of the logging stuff work when it never used to properly.
* Calendar got some changes - creating new events will send alerts, the 'week x' thing has been removed (due to it causing a great many problems that can't properly be fixed)
* 2.1 features an extended version of what 2.0 had for installings mods. Whereas in 2.0 you could enter a version of SMF for mods to 'emulate', 2.1 now has an auto-complete list of versions which is updated from our servers like the notifications about doing updates in general.
* In 1.1 and 2.0, when uploading an avatar, they would be stored in the attachments folder. As of 2.1, they are stored in their own folder which allows for them to be called directly, which has a major performance increase (so much so that doing it manually was the number 1 performance recommendation for years, now we've just made it automatic)
* Outgoing email has been tweaked so that it should be slightly more reliable by always issuing a message id (as opposed to the relay doing it) and this should also allow for better diagnosis of issues.
* Several 'configurable' options have been removed; if they are on by default and unlikely to ever be disabled, there's really no point them being optional. Specifically: 'simple search', the 'mark as read' button, the 'go up/down' buttons' and 'display items on the link tree as links', though there are also some options that the code was aware of but never used which have also been cleaned up.
* More of the images are now made part of the sprite we use, enables improvements in performance and RTL support.
* If you use paid subscriptions now, when you leave the forum to go to PayPal, it will hopefully use the right language for you. Also, AUD and CAD are now currencies listed as standard.
* When examining the files in a theme, the theme's name is displayed. Not a major change, but a useful one.
* When using the reports function to get a report of all the boards in your forum, the report will also inform you about redirect boards.
* Because of all the issues around non-UTF-8 and conversions, all new installs will be UTF-8 only. Upgrades will not force conversion to UTF-8, so your existing database will work as expected during an upgrade, but new installs will be UTF-8 only to keep everything that much simpler in the long term.
* Send this topic (as in by email) has been removed; people use copy/paste these days or various social services. We have not yet decided whether we are going to add social sharing functions in the default (and it's not like there aren't a number of choices out there already)
* The function to email users from the forum is being phased out. That's what PMs are for
* When uploading an avatar (or downloading an external one, if configured), the maximum size is shown.
* Web Slice support, what there was of it, has been removed.
* Polls added to topics, edited, locked, unlocked, reset or removed are all now logged in the moderation log.
* Users that are hidden do not reveal their last online time (unless the viewing user could see them anyway, e.g. by being an administrator)
* The footer has been rejigged a little; there's no longer a link to the credits page (that's now in the help area), the footer now also has the link to the help page (no longer in the main menu!) and the terms & rules / reg agreement are also linked from the footer.
* When moving items into and out of the recycle board, the 'recycle icon' is no longer changed permanently.
* When merging two topics, the secondary topic(s) will no longer be deleted, but will now be a redirection to the newly merged topic.
As you can see, there's a lot of little changes in addition to the big stuff - that's something that we're looking at: even the little details are important. With that in mind, there is going to be a complete top-to-bottom look at everything in SMF to polish it all up
As ever, you can see how it's going on our Github - http://github.com/SimpleMachines/SMF2.1 - but we're still officially in alpha, and things are likely to change on a daily basis; you should not be running it on a production site unless you are prepared to keep things up to date and understand the consequences of it; we cannot provide our usual level of support for people running alpha code.
Comments
And let me just add the praises of the Project Manager to to work of everyone who is contributing to the GitHub repository and those who are testing the nightly updates
QuoteWhen moving items into and out of the recycle board, the 'recycle icon' is no longer changed permanently.Soft-delete did manage to see the light of day? Nicely, nicely done
Of course, same for every other point. Kudos to you guys
No... the recycle bin is and always has been a kind of soft delete. It was just the behaviour that moving things into the recycle bin would also change their icon to recycled, and not change it back after. We just changed it so it didn't touch the icon and only displayed it as recycled inside the recycle bin.
I like everything I have read about the updates, thanks!
This one stuck out for me.
I agree so much with that. Don't know if you remember, but you helped me set my forum up so members could not email each other.
If members want to email each other then one member can PM the other member for their address. This way they both have to agree to it before emails are ever exchanged.
Thanks for all your hard work.
This one stuck out for me.
Quote* The function to email users from the forum is being phased out. That's what PMs are for
I agree so much with that. Don't know if you remember, but you helped me set my forum up so members could not email each other.
If members want to email each other then one member can PM the other member for their address. This way they both have to agree to it before emails are ever exchanged.
Thanks for all your hard work.
What an incredible job everyone is doing. 
Frankly, I'm really anxious to start using 2.1 in an active environment. My board has been online for 14 years, and with SMF since 2005, HOWEVER, having it polished and all of it's parts working smoothly is worth waiting for.
Way to GO, Team~!
"Thanks!" to each one of you who supports SMF and helps members like me on the support forums. You ALL make SMF the fabulous software that it is.
These updates are especially helpful.
Frankly, I'm really anxious to start using 2.1 in an active environment. My board has been online for 14 years, and with SMF since 2005, HOWEVER, having it polished and all of it's parts working smoothly is worth waiting for.
Way to GO, Team~!
"Thanks!" to each one of you who supports SMF and helps members like me on the support forums. You ALL make SMF the fabulous software that it is.
These updates are especially helpful.
@ApplianceJunk: that's exactly why we're trying to get rid of it.
@CountryLady: thanks!
Also, sneak peek of what I'm working on right now. Hardly that sneaky, though, I guess
@CountryLady: thanks!
Also, sneak peek of what I'm working on right now. Hardly that sneaky, though, I guess
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 10:45:51 PM
Also, sneak peek of what I'm working on right now. Hardly that sneaky, though, I guess
Excellent ! I've been using this mod for a while now; it has been very useful for my members who aren't very computer-literate.
BTW I love the improvements; there isn't a single change that I can disagree with. Great job everyone !
I assure you this is nothing like the mod you are using, it's built from scratch to work within the functionality of 2.1
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 10:45:51 PM
Also, sneak peek of what I'm working on right now. Hardly that sneaky, though, I guess
Glad to see that, very nice!
The mod we currently use for that works ok, but i can just image how it being a built in function of 2.1 will be so much better.
Well, it's linked in the footer next to the help and terms & rules links, I'm experimenting with making it behave as a popup like the screenshot (which is... interesting), but yeah, being built in should make maintenance of it easier in the long term.
What happens if someone has popups blocked in their browser settings?
That's the thing, as per my screenshot it's not a real popup. It's something that comes into the page and acts like a popup without actually BEING a popup. Several other things work the same way in 2.1, most notably the help popups.
I like that.
So do I it's one of the very nice things that the previous devs left me to play with, and I intend to make good use of it
it's one of the very nice things that the previous devs left me to play with, and I intend to make good use of it Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 06:10:32 PM* When merging two topics, the secondary topic(s) will no longer be deleted, but will now be a redirection to the newly merged topic.
Everything on the list sounds fantastic! (I specially like the avatar part.)
Will there be a moderator option to not leave the secondary topic redirection, or will it be necessary to delete the redirection topic after the merge if the redirection is not desired?
There is no moderator option, nor is there any plan to introduce one. The nearest I'm inclined to go is to have the redirection delete itself after x days (probably 5-7, unlikely to be configurable) because there are all sorts of edge cases about having this there, which is why I went through the hoops to implement it in the first place (took an entire evening to do that).
For private boards, granted, the impact is less, but for anything public, the benefit vastly outweighs the 'hassle' of having it.
For private boards, granted, the impact is less, but for anything public, the benefit vastly outweighs the 'hassle' of having it.
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 11:25:54 PM
That's the thing, as per my screenshot it's not a real popup. It's something that comes into the page and acts like a popup without actually BEING a popup. Several other things work the same way in 2.1, most notably the help popups.
With DHTML and particularly AJAX I'm not sure there is any technology left that can reliably block pop-ups. Or things that look like pop-ups but aren't.
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 11:46:09 PM
There is no moderator option, nor is there any plan to introduce one. The nearest I'm inclined to go...
Will there be any attribution to which mod/admin caused the merge? I'm a stealth admin on one forum and want to preserve my cover as an ordinary member. (My only duty is to keep the forum running and organized.) I'll delete the forward if necessary.
Might as well pick 7 days -- a week -- as the default. It fits nicely into the calendar and into our day/week/month/year time precepts.
Oh, I forgot to ask, is this the roadmap to 2.1 or are you speaking of a future 2.0.7->2.0.8 update?
By the way, I appreciate the well organized and detailed OP. Good job!
QuoteWith DHTML and particularly AJAX I'm not sure there is any technology left that can reliably block pop-ups. Or things that look like pop-ups but aren't.
Considering what AJAX is, if you're doing AJAXive techniques, you shouldn't be using real pop-ups anyway. The entire point of asynchronous requests is that you fetch parts of data and inject that into the current page context.
QuoteWill there be any attribution to which mod/admin caused the merge? I'm a stealth admin on one forum and want to preserve my cover as an ordinary member. (My only duty is to keep the forum running and organized.) I'll delete the forward if necessary.
There is, exactly as moves do. I would strongly encourage you not to delete the topic though, because it's done for multiple reasons - not least SEO. (Yes, that thing I despite and detest because most people don't understand what it means, the entire point of keeping the redirection is so that you retain the link - if you have two popular topics that get merged, you don't screw up any linkjuice to it)
QuoteOh, I forgot to ask, is this the roadmap to 2.1 or are you speaking of a future 2.0.7->2.0.8 update?
When have we ever done anything other than fixes in x.y.z to x.y.z+1 updates? Why would I be showing off a picture that specifically outlines 2.1's current theme? I don't reiterate it every month I do one of these because I figure most people that care enough by now know that we are doing maintenance only on 2.0 (and have been since 2011) and that as much developmental effort as possible is being spent on 2.1, just as it was in 2006 in the aftermath of 1.1.
We have enough to do without trying to actively develop two branches of SMF.
Also, no, this isn't a roadmap. A roadmap would tell you where we are going, not where we are right now and what has just been completed.
I may have missed it in another one of your update post, but will admins be able to edit topic and replies without the "Edited by..." being posted at the bottom of the post afterwards?
I have a mod that lets me do this now and have used the feature ever since I started with SMF years ago.
I have a mod that lets me do this now and have used the feature ever since I started with SMF years ago.
That is something we're still not entirely sure about adding.
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 03, 2014, 12:01:54 AMQuoteWith DHTML and particularly AJAX I'm not sure there is any technology left that can reliably block pop-ups. Or things that look like pop-ups but aren't.
Considering what AJAX is...
I write AJAX, I understand the techniques. It's a major part of my latest website. (Custom content delivery system.) That was my point, is that AJAX can emulate a pop-up without being a pop-up. Actually I don't even know how to do ordinary pop-ups. Never liked them, never needed them.
Let me explain again the situation. I am a stealth admin. Part of my deal (by my own request) is that only the other admins know I'm an admin. If a merge is attributed to me it will let the cat out of the bag. Totally not acceptable due to the situation on this forum. If there is attribution then deleting the forward is the only simple alternative. (I could reattribute it via phpMyAdmin but that's just too much trouble. I could create another admin account but that's just too much trouble. Heck, with PMA I could attribute the move to you!)
Please excuse my not knowing whether this a road-map or whatever. In fact after your explanation I'm uncertain if your OP pertains to 2.0.8 or 2.1. I recently returned to activity at SMF after a 3+ year hiatus and things have changed, I'm not familiar with the routine yet.
Anyway I like it no matter what release it's going into... except for the attribution.
Quote from: ApplianceJunk on February 03, 2014, 12:05:17 AM
I may have missed it in another one of your update post, but will admins be able to edit topic and replies without the "Edited by..." being posted at the bottom of the post afterwards?
I have a mod that lets me do this now and have used the feature ever since I started with SMF years ago.
Not a problem. I have a private mod that does this. Or did I release it? Shoosh, too many mods, to few hours in a day. In any case, just keep using your mod. if it quits working PM me and I'll submit my own mod.
I'm pretty sure I never released my mod. I didn't think it was a good idea, too subject to abuse. There's all kinds of mods that are just not fit to release because they would be subject to abuse and give SMF a bad name.
QuoteLet me explain again the situation. I am a stealth admin.
Great, so now you're talking down to me like I'm a child that doesn't understand. I will endeavour to reply in kind.
I already understood your concerns, I already took into account all of that when designing it - but the reality is, I implemented it exactly in line with the move topic functionality. Consistency really is a wonderful thing.
How you choose to run your site is irrelevant to me. If you do not like the functions as they are implemented, change them. You keep telling us how wonderful a modder you are (such that you keep reiterating that you have 25 published mods), you can change it to suit you. The reality is that the current situation will work better than what is currently done, for the majority of users. I am not building a system to suit a minority. It's a two line change to the code to change it. I'm sure with your mad leet skills you can manage that.
QuotePlease excuse my not knowing whether this a road-map or whatever
Taking some time to read the previous monthly topics would probably have helped.
QuoteIn fact after your explanation I'm uncertain if your OP pertains to 2.0.8 or 2.1
I'm sorry, which part of it was in any way ambiguous? 2.0.8 will be bug fixes only, just like 2.0.7, 2.0.6, 2.0.5, 2.0.4, 2.0.3, 2.0.2, 2.0.1, 1.1.19, 1.1.18, 1.1.17, 1.1.16, 1.1.15, 1.1.14, 1.1.13, 1.1.12, 1.1.11, 1.1.10, 1.1.9, 1.1.8, 1.1.7, 1.1.6, 1.1.5, 1.1.4, 1.1.3, 1.1.2, 1.1.1, 1.0.23, 1.0.22, 1.0.21, 1.0.20, 1.0.19, 1.0.18, 1.0.17, 1.0.16, 1.0.15, 1.0.14, 1.0.13, 1.0.12, 1.0.11, 1.0.10, 1.0.9, 1.0.8, 1.0.7, 1.0.6, 1.0.5, 1.0.4, 1.0.3, 1.0.2 and 1.0.1 were. Policy is that x.y.z to x.y.z+1 (like 2.0.7 to 2.0.8) is bug fix only. This has been the policy since SMF was first released in 2004. This is how it has always been, that the major release is the major release and that anything after is bug and/or security fixes.
In case this extra explanation wasn't clear: THIS IS FOR 2.1. THIS IS ALL FOR 2.1. 2.0.x GETS NO NEW FEATURES LIKE IT HAS NOT HAD IN OVER 2 YEARS.
QuoteI recently returned to activity at SMF after a 3+ year hiatus and things have changed, I'm not familiar with the routine yet.
You mean the same routine that it's been for 10 years.
Cumber, I tried to address our inability to be mutually cordial via PM but you have me blocked. Please suggest a method for me to communicate with you privately without airing dirty laundry in public.
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 06:10:32 PM
* The function to email users from the forum is being phased out. That's what PMs are for
Does that mean the email icon next to the pm icon will be going away and people won't be able to send emails to members anymore? For those of us on shared hosting where the amount of pm notifications are limited per day, I actually prefer when people send emails instead of having to use pm's. I'm guessing that there are also plenty of members on different sites that prefer emails because perhaps they think that admins can get access to their pm's.
br360, it's the same, actually. Those mails are also sent through SMF
Use the built-in mail queue and that should fix thing for you.
Use the built-in mail queue and that should fix thing for you.
QuoteCumber, I tried to address our inability to be mutually cordial via PM but you have me blocked. Please suggest a method for me to communicate with you privately without airing dirty laundry in public.
No. You have made it perfectly clear that even a 'truce' suggested by you can't even be upheld by you. As per your own personal text "I tried being reasonable and I didn't like it". It shows.
QuoteDoes that mean the email icon next to the pm icon will be going away and people won't be able to send emails to members anymore? For those of us on shared hosting where the amount of pm notifications are limited per day, I actually prefer when people send emails instead of having to use pm's. I'm guessing that there are also plenty of members on different sites that prefer emails because perhaps they think that admins can get access to their pm's.
Actually, PMs can quite easily use *less* emails over time than using emails will because people can actually opt out of emails for PMs. But if people want to use emails, they can use PMs to exchange email addresses and then take it entirely off the forum. Reality is that anyone who is bothered by privacy as you're getting at should be worried about the possibility that the email function is tapped too. While it isn't in the core distribution, it's not exactly hard to modify so that forum emails get logged.
But exactly as margarett says: whether SMF sends an email because an email is sent, or whether it sends it for a PM, it's *stilll sending an email* and still comes out of your quota.
Thanks for the update and hard work!
Will be checking the changes soon!
regards,
Maxx
Will be checking the changes soon!
regards,
Maxx
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 02, 2014, 10:55:44 PM
I assure you this is nothing like the mod you are using, it's built from scratch to work within the functionality of 2.1
Thank you ! One less mod for my forum. That's a good thing.
I have installed SMF 2.1 for testing. I pointed the URL to the proper folder, adjusted "Settings.php" in the "other" folder yet I only get a blank page when I browse to the index.php of the forum. Any ideas of what could be wrong?
This thread is not for support, please open a new thread in the 2.x Support area with full details, though that sounds a lot like you haven't actually installed it properly.
Quote from: Sir Cumber-Patcher on February 03, 2014, 08:03:29 AMNo. You have made it perfectly clear that even a 'truce' suggested by you can't even be upheld by you. As per your own personal text "I tried being reasonable and I didn't like it". It shows.
My avatar is Clint Eastwood. The quote is from one of his movies. I like Clint Eastwood as an actor/director and I admire his movies. Thus the avatar, thus the quote.
Look, Cumber, I have indicated my willingness to see if you and I can work out a peace by a man to man discussion, and you seem to be not up for it. You seem to have a closed mind. You are the one who is not being reasonable. You are the one who is not willing to discuss working out our differences.
Let the record show that I tried.
Everything is looking awesome. I have since decided to upgrade my active forum to the latest nightly build every night. I have a script set up that automagically pulls the GitHub repo, and then overwrites the files. Of course, I also have the ability to revert to a previous pull should something break.
I'm really liking where things are headed, and have been semi-actively hunting bugs when I find them. Having an active forum to test on is awesome, as it allows things to be done by others that some just wouldn't think of. It also helps that my users are always trying to break my forums anyways XD.
Anyways, keep up the awesome work! Here's to 2.1 Final and soon 3.0!
I'm really liking where things are headed, and have been semi-actively hunting bugs when I find them. Having an active forum to test on is awesome, as it allows things to be done by others that some just wouldn't think of. It also helps that my users are always trying to break my forums anyways XD.
Anyways, keep up the awesome work! Here's to 2.1 Final and soon 3.0!
Quote* Several 'configurable' options have been removed; if they are on by default and unlikely to ever be disabled, there's really no point them being optional. Specifically: 'simple search', the 'mark as read' button, the 'go up/down' buttons' and 'display items on the link tree as links', though there are also some options that the code was aware of but never used which have also been cleaned up.
Is this the configurable part which has been removed (always on so), or the options themselves <$1alt="" title="" onresizestart="return false;" id="smiley__$2" style="padding: 0 3px 0 3px;" /> ?(always off, kicked out??)
nb: edited with fucked code inside....what is this bins lol...
A few of the things might have been suggested or said before, but I list some of my idea's for SMF 2.1 here. Sorry if this post causes trouble.
- Here is an idea, the ability to disable attachments. That you can hide it from everywhere on the forum.
- Also, it could be a sweet feature where you can easily upload (and possibly remove) user badge icons in the admin panel.
- And for the packages, maybe a new style of listing? Where you can list the packages alphabetically and such. I'm currently also using a nice mod that makes three tables. One for the packages that can be installed, one that are installed and one for those that can't be installed.
- Quick moderation on quick reply. Nice mod, such be a feature in my opinion.
- A feature where you can add a page to list off all your news items.
- Bookmarks to topics?
- Default message icon?
- Ability for users to hide / ignore boards.
QuoteYou can disable permissions for users...
- Here is an idea, the ability to disable attachments. That you can hide it from everywhere on the forum.
Quotehttps://github.com/SimpleMachines/SMF2.1/pull/230 < Needs some love ^^
- Also, it could be a sweet feature where you can easily upload (and possibly remove) user badge icons in the admin panel.
QuoteNot sure i pass it to our luvly developers ^^
- And for the packages, maybe a new style of listing? Where you can list the packages alphabetically and such. I'm currently also using a nice mod that makes three tables. One for the packages that can be installed, one that are installed and one for those that can't be installed.
QuoteYea that looks useful ^^
- Quick moderation on quick reply. Nice mod, such be a feature in my opinion.
QuoteActually i suggested that before ^^
- A feature where you can add a page to list off all your news items.
QuoteSocial Share is something we are currently discussing.
- Bookmarks to topics?
Quoteisn't we have it already?
- Default message icon?
* Antes is confused :/
QuoteYou can't hide the board but you can ignore the board.
- Ability for users to hide / ignore boards.
About the attachments:
But it showed up in the profiles of my users. :/
And about the message icon.
Sorry for the derpy explanation. I meant that you could pick another icon as standard instead of changing the image file. Or do I look over a feature?
But it showed up in the profiles of my users. :/
And about the message icon.
Sorry for the derpy explanation. I meant that you could pick another icon as standard instead of changing the image file. Or do I look over a feature?
Quote from: GravuTrad on February 05, 2014, 06:15:29 PMQuote* Several 'configurable' options have been removed; if they are on by default and unlikely to ever be disabled, there's really no point them being optional. Specifically: 'simple search', the 'mark as read' button, the 'go up/down' buttons' and 'display items on the link tree as links', though there are also some options that the code was aware of but never used which have also been cleaned up.
Is this the configurable part which has been removed (always on so), or the options themselves <$1alt="" title="" onresizestart="return false;" id="smiley__$2" style="padding: 0 3px 0 3px;" /> ?(always off, kicked out??)
nb: edited with ******ed code inside....what is this bins lol...
I thought I was clear enough already, plus you can always check it yourself by trying it out.
As for the funny code, that's the result of the original 2.0.7 patch, one of the things fixed in the later patch.
As for the funny code, that's the result of the original 2.0.7 patch, one of the things fixed in the later patch.
new patch updated seems not applied here so...
About the removal of the mailing system. I have been thinking. I honestly think it shouldn't be removed. Think of these cases:
- Somebody wants to mail an inactive member.
- Somebody wants to send a mail to notify something.
I understand that the PM's are meant for that, but removing the whole mailing thing isn't such a great solution imo. Maybe a way to hide it?
Then, frankly, you weren't paying attention to what I said about removing.
Mailing an inactive member? That's what PMs are for.
Mailing to notify? You mean like a newsletter? Use the newsletter system.
Though, I'd hope people would also understand the way this is also a reduction in spam. But it's also not my problem now either.
Mailing an inactive member? That's what PMs are for.
Mailing to notify? You mean like a newsletter? Use the newsletter system.
Though, I'd hope people would also understand the way this is also a reduction in spam. But it's also not my problem now either.
Thanks for saying. Sorry for the derp.
Quote from: NekoJonez on February 12, 2014, 11:52:00 AMI agree. At worst let the devs write a mod package to add the feature back. Who is better situated to call out the +'s and -'s?
About the removal of the mailing system. I have been thinking. I honestly think it shouldn't be removed. Think of these cases:
- Somebody wants to mail an inactive member.
- Somebody wants to send a mail to notify something.
I understand that the PM's are meant for that, but removing the whole mailing thing isn't such a great solution imo. Maybe a way to hide it?
What do you think you are agreeing with?
The only thing that's been removed is the spam magnet of being able to send emails to users individually, one at a time, by clicking on the relevant icon under the poster information, or in the member list. You know: that thing you couldn't actually disable properly before... or the thing that tells the recipient your email address (which PMs doesn't do)
For which better alternatives exist that should be used.
I don't know why I'm defending it, it wasn't completely removed yet, but I guess the remaining devs could leave it in if they feel it's a good idea - even though it *really* isn't.
The only thing that's been removed is the spam magnet of being able to send emails to users individually, one at a time, by clicking on the relevant icon under the poster information, or in the member list. You know: that thing you couldn't actually disable properly before... or the thing that tells the recipient your email address (which PMs doesn't do)
For which better alternatives exist that should be used.
I don't know why I'm defending it, it wasn't completely removed yet, but I guess the remaining devs could leave it in if they feel it's a good idea - even though it *really* isn't.
Quote from: emanuele on February 16, 2014, 08:47:32 AMQuote from: Bigguy on February 15, 2014, 08:00:37 PMSeveral people have tried that and all failed.
Who ever is talkin SMF is dead. I don't think it is. I think it needs a big kick in the ass is what I think it needs. All this talk about forums dying and all that is not helpin SMF's case at all. As far as I see it the more you go with it the better the chances. But hey, what do I know right. I mean I have only been here since....well, when ever, lol.
It's like havin a dog with three legs...would you put it down or stand by it and help it along and no there is no "Only for so long" crap either. if ya start something then you see it through. The good times and the bad. It' seems to me people have forgotten that for some reason. I don't know. Maybe I am just a die hard.
Either there are no "die hard" developers, or just the conditions to contribute are so bad that is easier to say goodbye and do something else.
You can't expect people coming "later" to have the same loyalty you have for SMF.
I don't have it for example. I have respect for anyone that worked on the script, but apart from that, I go where I see I can do what I think it's necessary to do. I tried to give something to SMF, but when all the others didn't give a damn and didn't react to anything I asked, my reaction has been: "heck, if they that have a sentimental reason to keep SMF alive don't do anything, why should I waste time trying to revive the project?"
And the same way, I don't expect to see you feel what I feel for ElkArte: I am proud of it because I participated in founding it and building it. You didn't, so I don't expect you to have any particular reason to contribute anything to it if I were to say goodbye.
It's not a bad thing per se, it's just how it works. And it's fine with me. I understand it.
Now, on the pure figures:
These are the stats of sm.org from its born to January this year.
Nice post Emanuele.
Quote from: Bigguy on February 15, 2014, 08:00:37 PM
Who ever is talkin SMF is dead. I don't think it is. I think it needs a big kick in the ass is what I think it needs. All this talk about forums dying and all that is not helpin SMF's case at all. As far as I see it the more you go with it the better the chances. But hey, what do I know right. I mean I have only been here since....well, when ever, lol.
It's like havin a dog with three legs...would you put it down or stand by it and help it along and no there is no "Only for so long" crap either. if ya start something then you see it through. The good times and the bad. It' seems to me people have forgotten that for some reason. I don't know. Maybe I am just a die hard.
You can't make volunteers do things they don't ant to do. You can't ignore what they are saying and tell them to "just do it". The thing about volunteer work, is that the person is not obligated to do anything. So once you corrupt the moral, the volunteer loses inspiration and/or motivation.
Like Emanuele said: "conditions to contribute are so bad that is easier to say goodbye and do something else".
I've ran a few very small volunteer projects. I also have several years of experience in being a manager or being in a leadership position. From what I've learned, volunteer or not, you have to make those you employ feel like they are part of the greater good, not make them feel like they are working for something that is dying or behind modernization. That what they are doing will make a see-able or even tangible difference. This is done by doing many things like staying constantly involved, listening and not just hearing, acquiring feedback and taking action, keeping production organized through the whole stage, setting goals, marking milestones, compromising with your team, and coaching for improvement.
One of the "dirty tricks" I've used is to "motivation towards achievement through cleanup". What I would do here, is port all issues from mantis to Github(I know some wouldn't like that). From there, I would address all the "easy issues" first. Either by moving them out and into a 2.2 section, or by addressing the issue.
The reason I would do that is because if you were interested or even involved in the project, would you be more motivated to work on a project with 300 issues, or a project with 30 issues? For example, would you like to contribute to Elgg?
You also have to look at pull requests. Any potential developer from outside the community would not want to take part in a project that some serious outstanding pull requests. Currently, SMF has some that are over a year old. Why? Also, there are PR's that are outstanding that only change one small file. These should be merged or closed, with or without explanation.
Stuff like this needs to be knocked out ASAP to keep up the appearance of a cleaner, slimmer, software with a team that is on top of it.
Is this a real solution? No, it's not. It doesn't help the current developer who has to address the more serious stuff, but it helps every where else. I was excited when I seen Arantor knock out over half of the issues, and issues that were added by him and fixed by him in the same day. I was like, "hell yeah". How many others were inspired by this?
Now there are some outstanding issues that were added, and I'm like "yuk...", and I'm less motivated to get involved in a project that isn't even close to being close to it's goal. How many others felt this way?
Knocking out the easy stuff creates the image of being "more productive". Which in truth, you are considering the time frame. Would you want to spend 1 month knocking out 1 issue, or 1 month knocking out 30 issues?
I would sic 1 developer on the serious issues and put everyone else on the small crap. Then when the small issues are out of the way, get them more involved in the serious stuff. That's what I would do to try to keep motivation going, but I also understand this doesn't really get the software hit it's goal within a time frame. However, if you get the small stuff done throughout the whole process of the goals, I think you would be surprised at quickly you will reach your goal.
You may agree wholey, partly, or flat out disagree with the concept, but that's just how I would do it.
The reason I would do that is because if you were interested or even involved in the project, would you be more motivated to work on a project with 300 issues, or a project with 30 issues? For example, would you like to contribute to Elgg?
You also have to look at pull requests. Any potential developer from outside the community would not want to take part in a project that some serious outstanding pull requests. Currently, SMF has some that are over a year old. Why? Also, there are PR's that are outstanding that only change one small file. These should be merged or closed, with or without explanation.
Stuff like this needs to be knocked out ASAP to keep up the appearance of a cleaner, slimmer, software with a team that is on top of it.
Is this a real solution? No, it's not. It doesn't help the current developer who has to address the more serious stuff, but it helps every where else. I was excited when I seen Arantor knock out over half of the issues, and issues that were added by him and fixed by him in the same day. I was like, "hell yeah". How many others were inspired by this?
Now there are some outstanding issues that were added, and I'm like "yuk...", and I'm less motivated to get involved in a project that isn't even close to being close to it's goal. How many others felt this way?
Knocking out the easy stuff creates the image of being "more productive". Which in truth, you are considering the time frame. Would you want to spend 1 month knocking out 1 issue, or 1 month knocking out 30 issues?
I would sic 1 developer on the serious issues and put everyone else on the small crap. Then when the small issues are out of the way, get them more involved in the serious stuff. That's what I would do to try to keep motivation going, but I also understand this doesn't really get the software hit it's goal within a time frame. However, if you get the small stuff done throughout the whole process of the goals, I think you would be surprised at quickly you will reach your goal.
You may agree wholey, partly, or flat out disagree with the concept, but that's just how I would do it.
And suddenly 2 pages disappear 
Oop, nvm found em http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=518676.0
Oop, nvm found em http://www.simplemachines.org/community/index.php?topic=518676.0
The mantis stuff has been being moved into GitHub.
And the devs have been looking at pull requests. Yes, they may not have been merged... But that does not mean that they have not been looked at.
And the devs have been looking at pull requests. Yes, they may not have been merged... But that does not mean that they have not been looked at.
Quote from: Xarcell on February 16, 2014, 10:52:05 AM
One of the "dirty tricks" I've used is to "motivation towards achievement through cleanup". What I would do here, is port all issues from mantis to Github(I know some wouldn't like that). From there, I would address all the "easy issues" first. Either by moving them out and into a 2.2 section, or by addressing the issue.
Knocking out the easy stuff creates the image of being "more productive". Which in truth, you are considering the time frame. Would you want to spend 1 month knocking out 1 issue, or 1 month knocking out 30 issues?
I would sic 1 developer on the serious issues and put everyone else on the small crap. Then when the small issues are out of the way, get them more involved in the serious stuff. That's what I would do to try to keep motivation going, but I also understand this doesn't really get the software hit it's goal within a time frame. However, if you get the small stuff done throughout the whole process of the goals, I think you would be surprised at quickly you will reach your goal.
You may agree wholey, partly, or flat out disagree with the concept, but that's just how I would do it.
I was trying my best not to get involved with all this shit but your post is just plain unavoidable...
First you say you don't want to force anyone else but then you talk and treat devs like they were cattle you can just move and make them work on things "ASAP"... theres some pretty hefty incongruence right there... if thats what you would do it then I see no difference to what we already have...
Quote
The reason I would do that is because if you were interested or even involved in the project, would you be more motivated to work on a project with 300 issues, or a project with 30 issues? For example, would you like to contribute to Elgg?
Stuff like this needs to be knocked out ASAP to keep up the appearance of a cleaner, slimmer, software with a team that is on top of it.
Why would anyone want to contribute to a project that has no issues at all?
First thing to move forward is accepting that your project isn't perfect and that it will always gonna need changes, I'm glad that SMF has so many issues posted on github after been ignored for such a long time (by the people that now are complaining that we don't do anything about them... oh the irony!!!).
Quote
Is this a real solution? No, it's not. It doesn't help the current developer who has to address the more serious stuff, but it helps every where else. I was excited when I seen Arantor knock out over half of the issues, and issues that were added by him and fixed by him in the same day. I was like, "hell yeah". How many others were inspired by this?
Now there are some outstanding issues that were added, and I'm like "yuk...", and I'm less motivated to get involved in a project that isn't even close to being close to it's goal. How many others felt this way?
So you want to enslave us 24/7 to work on SMF so you could be happy? How many others felt this way?
I've keep reading how everyone started to jump out and said random datelines like there was their decision to make such datelines... it is utterly funny.
There are way too many issues, you saying "yuk" is not going to automatically make them dissapear nor is going to make any difference. The same for all the people that have posted on this and the other topic, you saying whatever you feel about this issue isn't gonna change anything, I'm sorry but you're not that important...
Quote
You also have to look at pull requests. Any potential developer from outside the community would not want to take part in a project that some serious outstanding pull requests. Currently, SMF has some that are over a year old. Why? Also, there are PR's that are outstanding that only change one small file. These should be merged or closed, with or without explanation.
Really? is that the way you will handle it? Closing them just to keep the appearance of a "clean" project? mmm, that sounds even more counter-productive that what we have now... if you're a fan of keeping the dirt under the carpet so your neighbors don't see it thats your prerogative, I much rather prefer everyone to see my house is a mess and see my working on it but thats just my opinion and it seems that my opinion doesn't mean shit, heck, I'm just cattle that needs to do whatever the complainers say I should do... except that you cannot even reach an agreement... all you do is yell and squawk to whoever crosses your sigh...
It is utterly funny to read everyones opinions on how 2 single and pretty much isolated persons are suppose to work but none of you actually do anything
As for contributing, you don't actually need to be here to contribute, you don't need to "deal with the rest of the team" and all that crap I've hearing, since I got back I hardly ever posted on team boards and I just visit this forum because I'm used to do it rather than be forced to be here to contribute...
The true is, you can't really just contribute "fun stuff" or "whatever I want to work on" only, a script as large as this one has too many "boring" places that needs to be addressed, coding stuff for fun is awesome but you also need to have some level of commitment towards a project, if you're serious about a project, you will eventually face boring stuff you will have to deal with, is unavoidable, you can, of course, run away from the responsibility and start a new fork... oops!
I for once, would never said bad things a bout I project I contributed, why? because I contributed to those things, for better or for worst I was part of it, help building the bad and the good stuff. I find it utterly funny when people left and start saying crap about things they themselves were a big part of. Its just plain stupid, like spitting to the sky and not moving a single inch to avoid it...
And now, if you excuse me, I will resume my work, you guys can keep squawking and ranting all you want, again, it won't make any difference. All you guys managed to do is keep us away from you, happily, I can still work and keep pushing for a release without actually having to deal with any of you
Thank you Suki and everyone else that contributes to SMF.
I sincerely appreciate all the work everyone puts into SMF and try to voice that every now and then.
Thanks again,
I sincerely appreciate all the work everyone puts into SMF and try to voice that every now and then.
Thanks again,
Quote from: ApplianceJunk on February 16, 2014, 04:52:48 PM
Thank you Suki and everyone else that contributes to SMF.
I sincerely appreciate all the work everyone puts into SMF and try to voice that every now and then.
Thanks again,
DITTO~! ....w00t~!
@Suki
What would you recommend?
What would you recommend?